Comments on: Three's A Crowd

By: Cat

Cat — Thu, 24 Oct 2013 20:32:19 +0000

This topic is very close to me and my family, and everyone’s experience and opinions expressed here are very interesting and helpful. This whole thread is like therapy for me. As a parents of two pre-teen girls, who could not be more different socially, I had many times when I just wished I didn’t react, but rather sleep on it. My older daughter is the classic example of “always excluded, clingy friend, whose world comes apart the moment her friend moves on to a new interest”. My younger one is a social butterfly, care free, to whom the other kids are naturally drawn. It is quite a task for me to manage her social agenda and keep track of all her playdates / sleepover requests. My oldest daughter is what preoccupies me most. Even though she is sweet, good natured, and want to make friends, for some reason, her insecurity is perceived as a weakness, and for that reason, she is easily subjected to either bullying or social exclusion. On one hand, of course, our main task as parents, is to increase her self-esteem, and help her not to be afraid to stand for herself (she often says she afraid to tell to the teacher when someone is crossing the line with her, because she does not want to be a tatter-tale!). It is a lot of work , and it is her personality that might make it more difficult for her to make friends.
But on the other hand, and maybe because I am constantly on a lookout, I have been observing the other girls, whether out in the street or in other social situations, and I have to says : “Boy, some girls can be mean!”. I have witness many incidents myself.

I am always on the fence about what to do next: should I approach the child , the parent, etc or should I just let my child handle the situation? There are two parents camps out there : “the helicopter” parents, and the parents of a cookie-cutter, who never have to worry whether their child is accepted or has friends.
It is interesting, the Scholastic News recently has a debate question for kids “Should the parents of kids who are caught bullying be fined or not?”. My older daughter said “Yes”, my younger one said “No”.

I had times when I reached out to the teacher or a parent, and tactfully explained my concern. Reactions in general were civil but did not provide any closure. In the end, I end up feeling like I worry too much or overreact. Keep in mind – most probably you get very emotional when your kid comes home crying , or sad that they had a bad day, or just feeling blue for a period of time. Your instinct gut reaction is to want to fix things, and fix them now. Kids are indeed resilient, and they will move on much quicker than we do. The most difficult task for me is to remain calm, get the facts, don’t show too much emotions, and don’t feed into her need for sympathy. I admit, I don’t always manage to do that. Often kids just want to vent, and just needs someone to listen. Teaching them how to deal with adversity might help them for later on in life.
I know that right now, best thing for me is to talk, talk, talk to my daughter, and instill in her the confidence that she will need to make the right decisions, especially later when the consequences can be much, much more serious. The desire to fit in, and be accepted, at all costs, can be quite dangerous. I tell her often – move on, if someone is mean to you or excluding you, just find someone else who is friendlier, or go do something fun. I also tell her – don’t be afraid to stand for who you are, because not all kids are the same, and you do not need to fit a certain image.

I do wonder though – wouldn’t the other parent would like to know if/when their kids might not be the nicest with some other kids? I know I would! I asked myself often: maybe my kids are not the nice kids that I see at home, maybe out there on the playground, when they know there are no adults watching, maybe are saying or doing things that would not make me the proudest parent of the day. I don’t think that is the case. I am sure all parents think the same though! All the best to everyone.

By: chemdadbrian

chemdadbrian — Fri, 18 Oct 2013 01:43:17 +0000

This may not help, but in our case, we moved addresses.

By: Charisa

Charisa — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 17:35:51 +0000

Make sure that your daughter understands that this dynamic is not her fault. Encourage your daughter to invite other girls to the house. Don’t allow her to play with the girls that are mean to her unless under your direct supervision. If something happens when you are watching the 3 of them, you can say something like, “At our house we treat everyone with kindness and respect. If you aren’t able to do that, you won’t be able to play here anymore.” I’ve had success with this myself.

By: Joe Van Deuren

Joe Van Deuren — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 16:32:08 +0000

In reply to Debbie Campbell.

Debbie,
Unfortunately most teachers do not receive any training in dealing with aggressive behavior with their students. All they have to go on is their own experience, which many times has not been a very good one. I am am advocate for teacher training in this regard, as it is just as important as any of the other things that they will learn in school.
Understanding the time that we need to deal with emotional and social issues in the school community is so important. They are all going to learn 1+1 in time, but when a student no longer feels safe – learning will be very difficult if not possible at all.

By: Julie

Julie — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 16:03:45 +0000

In reply to Joe Van Deuren.

I agree with your comment about talking to the parents. Our 16yr old son is in a sitution where his long term baseball buddies have decided they don’t want to hang with him anymore. What has changed? Our son no longer can play baseball due to medical issues. He is a normal kid…thinks/acts like a normal kid but he cannot play baseball any longer. One of the boys parents are good friends of ours. Due to a few things that have happened (such as we come over for a tail gate party prior to a HS football game. All the boys leave, but our son is still downstairs eating. EVERYONE had to notice he was still there?!) The parents did not notice anything wierd.
Childish pranks are happening at our house. We do not know who it is but we have our suspicisions.
Our advice to our son – let’s work to get him involved in other things. STOP ALL inter action with these boys.
They truly are not a definitio of “friend” we adhere to in life.

By: Julie

Julie — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:55:33 +0000

In reply to Bridget.

I am on the other end of the situation listed above but the message here is the need to tell the other parents is a good choice.
My son is 16 yrs old and for health purposes (suffered headaches and ended up having brain surgery 2x!) chose not to play baseball since the summer of his freshman year. He is now a Junior. His long time baseball buddies have chosen to ignore him. He asks what is wrong and they just say “nothing”. Now childish pranks are happening – Eggs thrown in our driveway and little notecards left with childish cruel pictures on them. We know they are for our son becase they have his name on them! We cannot prove who has left these “presents” at our house, but we have our suspicions. We now are just telling our son, to move on – break those ties. It stinks and it is tough! My son is learning how to be strong, resilent, and grown up pretty fast! One of the boys parents are our good friends. They have to know what is going on. We have been wondering if it is worth mentioning anything to them or no?

By: Debra Vigliano

Debra Vigliano — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:49:40 +0000

As the founder and executive director of a non-profit organization, Win-Win-Resolutions http://www.winwinresolutions.org that has served over 35,000 students and families since 2001 with interactive anti-bullying programs, I recommend you and the other parents (if all are willing to come to the table) to set up a time in neutral territory (might take them to a park or ice cream store) to talk and share. We have seen many aggressive students develop empathy by giving them a safe place to talk from the 1st person using “I messages” as in your daughter saying to the other two girls “I feel upset when you leave me out because it really hurts my feelings and I would like to play with you”. The other girls would then repeat what they heard your daughter say and each have a turn to share their feelings. It is important to let your daughter know that in life we don’t always get our requests granted but at the very least she will have an opportunity to have some closure and then as others have suggested create other social opportunities for her to make new friends if the other girls are not willing to include her. Three girls hanging out tends to create a lot of drama and hurt feelings but at least the other two girls that are starting to display bully behavior can be made aware of how that negatively impacts someone else and hopefully be able to experience how that might feel if they were in your daughter’s shoes. The other important step is to let your daughter know that she did not do anything wrong and the only thing we can control in life is how we react to negative situations and conflicts. I know that is a hard lesson for young girls but with all the rise of cyberbullying, our children need to be made aware of the consequences of their behavior and start a conversation to develop compassion and empathy.

By: Debbie Campbell

Debbie Campbell — Thu, 17 Oct 2013 14:45:43 +0000

As a mother who didn’t pay enough attention to her daughter’s tears and hurt feelings and now have to deal with my guilt as I watch my emotionally damaged adult daughter try to heal, I would just add that whatever you do, DO NOT downplay this as “just how kids act” and say things like “it will get better”. I got TERRIBLE advice form the teachers in her life as they just didn’t want (or didn’t know how) to deal with it effectively.

By: Mother of teenage girls

Mother of teenage girls — Wed, 16 Oct 2013 23:50:23 +0000

This is such a common issue .. and it seems that it is always worse with girls. Relationships are so important for girls, thus feeling ‘left out’ can be one of the unfortunate consequences. I would have to say, as a mother of 2 girls (now 14 and 16 yrs), the best advice of all that given above is that ‘you cant make people like you .. or your children’. We all know that there are people we click with and people who we just dont like, or dont feel anything for. In the adult world we tend to have more chioce about who we spend time with and who we just avoid .. and it doesnt usually turn into a problem or become bullying (Note that I say ‘usually’, as I know there is still a lot of nastiness between adults insensitively ‘leaving people out’). May be you have more in common with your adult neighbours, that your daughter has with their girls? And sometimes behaviour that is seen as bullying, is just children not knowing how to say ‘I dont really ‘click’ with you’ or ‘I prefer to play with this other child as we have more in common or we interact in more similar ways’. I think that observing the play when all 3 are together, and trying to take your ‘mummy’ glasses off (so that you can observe the situation objectively) will help you determine if this is the case. You may also be in a position to kindly suggest, to the other girls, alternative ways of behaving/speaking, when the group are together, which would respectfully communicate their feelings to your daughter. If there is just not a connection between the 3, you would then serve your daughter better, by helping her to find alternative friends…. I had a similar situation with my 14 year old and I now just make sure I only see one of the families at a time .. It means my daughter doesnt get left out as it is not a 3-some. I just had to accept that the other 2 girls had more in common and liked each other more than they like my daughter. That is fine. not everyone likes everyone else!!! Having said all of that, I wish you luck … and remind you that there are far worse things your daughter may have to face in life, so this is probably only one small, difficult lesson for her …and you. May the outcome be positive.

By: Cathy Colledge

Cathy Colledge — Wed, 16 Oct 2013 22:43:58 +0000

I am a first grade teacher (7 year olds) and the mother of a daughter. I strongly caution this mom to be very careful about interfering in this situatution too much. 7 year old emotions are still very immature and volital. What makes me cry right now may be forgotten in two hours. what may sound like mean talk may be unfiltered comments comming from a six or seven year old, who is still discovering which actions or words may hurt others. A better solution than confronting parents may be to ask the girls to take a break if their play ends up in squabbles. “OK, time for everybody to go to their own house for half an hour, and then come back over for a popsicle.” for instance. My daughter played with two other little girls in the neighborhood, one of which had a younger mother who was horrified when the girls resorted to calling names and pulling hair. We older and wiser mothers had to have a heart to heart with her, and explain thatthe kids usually worked out their own problems more quickly and with less trauma than when we interfered. We all agreed to seperate them when they ganged up on one, got physical, or made somebody cry, without comment or blame, and then each coach our own child on kind and polite behavior in a group, and how to stand up for yourself without making others angery. It worked really well for our friendships and the girls’. They gradually grew into appropriate social behavior, and became close friends who could be inclusive. If it is always the same two against one, then there may be bullying going on. In that case, help your daughter learn to give an assertive response, such as, “I don’t like being called names. My name is Penny, and that is what I want to be called. Let’s go swing now.” If that doesn’t work, your daughter should walk away. Be sure she has lots of oppertunities to meet other friends. Church is a good place, or enroll her in dance or gymnastics. If the behavior intensifies, if she begins to show signs of anxiety, such as not sleeping or not wanting to go to school, making negative comments about herself, it is time to get together with the other parents, and follow Ron’s thoughtful advice. I caution everyone consider child development factors, and not try to view childrens’ experiences from an adult point of view. I see plenty of bullies and mean girls at school, but I also see children developing social skills in child like ways. The differences are subtle, so be sure you get all the facts and weigh the child’s social development against villification of those she is interacting with, who may be acting age appropriately.