Comments on: Perspective on “Quiet Quitting” https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/ VitalSmarts is now Crucial Learning Wed, 25 Jan 2023 23:31:02 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.5.2 By: Scott Robley https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10536 Wed, 25 Jan 2023 23:31:02 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10536 Thank you all so much for your feedback. I appreciate the candid call out and can see where you are coming from. It was never my intention to say or even suggest that anyone should use Crucial Conversation skills to manipulate teachers into doing more for nothing.

I can see from where I say, “So how do you help?” and reference teachers no longer going above and beyond that I have unintentionally led people astray. It appears that I am supporting the premise of “How do we get teachers to return to doing uncompensated work.” That is most definitely not my point.

My intended point was to answer the question, “What do you do when you suspect a teacher is quietly quitting?” As a former educator I empathize with a teacher’s feelings of being stuck so they quit: sometimes all at once and sometimes little by little. As they disengage, then you as leader feel stuck. That’s when it is important to become curious and check your narrative. Be open to other’s perspectives and genuinely explore contributing factors. The Six-Source model is a framework to explore all possible causes – including those you as a leader may be doing, the stresses the role and the system place on teachers, as well as incentives or lack thereof.

As leaders it is our responsibility to support the people we lead. The best way to do that is to make the undiscussables discussable and addressable. All of this with the intent to help teachers find meaning and purpose in a field with lots of meaning and purpose.

Because of your willingness to share, I can use your feedback to improve and be better next time. Thanks again for being partners in this process as we all strive to improve.

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By: Danielle Johnson https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10526 Tue, 24 Jan 2023 21:43:27 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10526 People “act their wage”. If they work for an organization that truly values them then they will be paid appropriately. If they work for an organization that does not pay a living wage, ie: teachers, then they are motivated to work comparable to their given wage. If I take a job where I’m not getting paid a living wage I will do the bare minimum. If I’m paid a living wage and treated well I will go above and beyond. In short you get what you pay for.

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By: Andy https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10519 Thu, 19 Jan 2023 21:40:27 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10519 I’m in agreement mostly with the responses here. It should not be expected of anyone in the work force to perform work during unpaid hours. I see this a lot in the government arena where employees of a certain professional level are expected by superiors to produce regardless of the time put in, not claim overtime or comp time, and “be a team player”. This goes for managers and non-managers alike.

As a manager I will not expect anyone on the team to participate in this false “do whatever it takes to get the job done” attitude and have made it clear to my superiors. My first response is and will continue to be “What tasks are you OK with NOT being completed?”

Don’t commit to the work if you lack the resources to get it done under normal circumstances. When exceptions arise try to pull the team together to work out a solution on company time.

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By: Flabbergasted https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10517 Thu, 19 Jan 2023 03:39:11 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10517 Normally I quite enjoy this blog, so I was shocked by this response. The narrative being normalized here is that teachers should be going above and beyond, and that if they don’t they are not being responsible, and it is the leader’s responsibility to hold these teachers accountable. Hold them accountable for what, exactly? For a system and a society that demeans and devalues them? For structures that ask them to do more than they logistically have time for? I have worked both in and out of education. In no other industry have I been asked to continue my work on my own time in order to be considered a responsible employee. In no other industry have I been held accountable to 23 different indicators as well as to normed scores on standardized tests taken by others (i.e. students). I feel disappointed by the tone of this article that seems more intent on validating the author’s own biases about educators than on critically and authentically addressing the systemic issue of expecting teachers to work unpaid hours brought up by “quietly wondering.”

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By: Pat Redmond https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10515 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 21:44:08 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10515 I have never liked that terminology. They aren’t quitting or being the bad guys. They are finally standing up for themselves. Life is too short to spend all of your time doing extras for your job that you are not paid for. If it’s something that needs to be done, then they should be paid for their time.

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By: ZeroPoint Strategies https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10514 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 20:29:40 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10514 This is a systemic and structural problem across many industries. As long as there are not enough resources supplied to deal with the work load, greater demand is placed on the resources. The ‘cost focus’ is primary and the “service delivery’ is secondary at best. Arbitrary budget limitations drive much of this behavior.

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By: Jeff Grigg https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10513 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 18:23:50 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10513 I believe that accepting and using the terminology of “Quiet Quitting and Accountability” in the title of this article, as has been done here, is accepting the “framing” of the situation as presented by one side, to the detriment of the other side. I believe this to be is an extremely biased framing.

Same for what appears to be a “False Dichotomy” between “Work-to-Rule” and “Rules of Work”, presented in the article. Traditional union “Work-to-Rule” events include insisting on time-consuming time-wasting rule conformance that is not normally done under normal working conditions. That is not at all comparable to failing to voluntarily work a heavy load of unpaid overtime work.

Let’s assume that the work agreement is to show up for some given hours of work and perform a reasonably effective professional job of the work. Then an expectation that employees must perform far above and beyond that, to be considered “reasonable performance” is an entirely unreasonable expectation.

“Setting Boundaries” for “Reasonable Work-Life Balance” *within* the framework of the actual work agreement seems often to be labeled as “Quite Quitting” by some.

First we need a reasonable and largely unbiased “framing” of the situation before we can really consider who’s expectations and performance are reasonable, and within the bounds of the work agreement, or not.

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By: James Brown https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10512 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 17:14:00 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10512 In a lot of areas teachers have always had low pay. So the question is more about what is different now? My wife is a 25 year veteran teacher who is struggling with the constant barrage of challenges others are making to the whole system. Society currently has many people who question the values, ethics and activities of teachers. It’s hard to put in extra effort when students are hearing from their parents and talk shows that school is about indoctrination and that teachers are those who failed to make it in the real world. Combine that with politicians who make unreasonable demands and you have both the Social and Structural areas of influence working against the educators.

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By: Vicky https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10510 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 16:16:27 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10510 As I’ve read about “quiet quitting” and in the case the question brings up, I don’t see it in the same category as “lazy” or “sticking it” to anyone. It appears to me as setting boundaries without the conversation about boundaries. If only there was a way to teach people to have those tough sort of conversations! 😉

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By: Edward G https://cruciallearning.com/blog/quiet-quitting-and-accountability/#comment-10509 Wed, 18 Jan 2023 14:56:34 +0000 https://cruciallearning.com/?p=17772#comment-10509 Jeff N makes a great point. In any organization there are people who only do the minimum. Another way to think about the education question is “Would you work 40 hours a week and only being a part time employee and get paid for only 20 hours?” There has to be a balance on both sides. Realistic working conditions and employee enthusiasm. Not an easy balance for any organization, especially high performing organizations.

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